[DeMarie]

Based on "Weight loss surgery for dummies", my nutritionist, Doc Sanae...
there is a ratio to figure out daily protein intake:

0.8 times weight in kilograms
(to figure out kilo it's weight times 0.45)

example (me) 270 x 0.45 = 121.5 (k) x 0.8 = 97.2 grams protein a day

or

weight times 0.36

example (me) 270 x 0.36 = 97.2 grams protein a day

recalculate as you lose weight.

Doc Sanae - can you verify?
Also - what's the range (+ or -) we can go?

[DocSanae]

First off, don't calculate at your present weight, actually, since you are trying to lose.
If you calculate at your present weight, you are calculating the amount you need NOT TO LOSE WEIGHT.
So, you need to use your goal weight.

Also, when we give instructions on nutrition, we calculate from the recommended total calorie intake for that person,rather than use the per kilogram numbers. Calories from protein should be between 10-35% of total calories, for bypass patients, probably 25-35%. So, if your total intake is 1000kcal (to make the example easy) you need to get 250-350kcals from protein. Translated into grams, it is 350 divided by 4 (as 1g protein equals 4kcals) which is 87.5g, 250/4=62.5.

Now, the average protein turnover (the amount of protein one needs to replenish what the body used) is said to be 35-50g per day. So, the recommended amount for the average person ranges from 50-75g according to medical textbooks. That's the why of the 60g surgeons tell you. Since men are more muscular than women, they need more protein, but still, within this range (50-75) is enough.

For women, over 100g per day under normal circumstances (read this as you are a regular person, not a professional athlete, or a body builder type person) is too much, so you should keep your protein intake below this.

[Dx E]

Denise,
Others may (and clearly do) vary-
From my nutritionist-

"To get minimum daily protein needs-
multiply body weight in kilograms by 0.8
or multiple body weight in pounds by 0.37.
Either of these result in the number of grams of protein
that approximates the minimum daily need for a Non-Op.
For RNY’ers My Nutritionist recommended an additional 12%
To accommodate the mal-absorption of protein."

The one that was in my Physical Therapist’s “Nutrition for Healing” handout
Was specifically for Men and a little more complex-

1. Weight in pounds divided by 2.2 = weight in kg
2. Weight in kg x 0.8-1.8 gm/kg = protein gm.
*Use a lower number if you are in good health and are sedentary.
*Use a higher number (between 1 and 1.8) if you are under stress,
Are recovering from an illness,
Or if you are involved in consistent weight or endurance training.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Example: 154 lb male who gets regular strenuous exercise (cardio or weights)
154 lbs/2.2 = 70kg
70kg x 1.5 = 105 gm protein/day

**also need to figure approx. 10% to 15% mal-absorption of Protein.

Check with YOUR Bariatric Doc for formula specifically for You.
Best Wishes-
Dx

[DeMarie]

Gee wiz!! My nutritionist told me that!!!

Kim (antbunni), that nutritionist from the support group that you don't ever think knows what she is talking about! Confirmed!

Thanks Doc!

[DeMarie]

OK - wait! Dx, your kinda saying the way I had it first.

[Dx E]

Originally Posted by DeMarie

OK - wait! Dx, your kinda saying the way I had it first.

And I had 2 Different "Ways."
One from my Nutritionist,
And the other from my Physiologist.

At least my Serum Albumin Levels have been Great for nearly 5 years....
So I guess I'm getting in enough.

Best Wishes-
Dx

[DeMarie]

Well, thank me for confusing everybody even more .
One thing's for sure - ask your Doctor!
I actually never did - I got my info from the nutritionist.

[MsVickie]

My surgeon give me the way that Doc Stated. To much protein is as bad as not getting in enough.

This is somthing that happened to me: My tummy wasnt woke up after surgery and I had a pretty severe time of it. When he scoped me he told me what was going on. I was in the protein phaze really heavy because I was so worried nothing was staying down. He told me to mix beer with tomato juice to get my electrolytes back up for a week and drink one a day. The tomato juice would help get the tummy working and the beer would add the fluids in. Well.... excessive protien and beer equal GOUT! The protien was comming from the powders and what little meat I was able to get down. If you have never had GOUT be thankful. My toe knuckles on both feet killed me so bad I couldnt walk for 3 days. You have to remember you body gets rid of it for a reason just like Vitamin C.

So to me that is all the proff I needed not to overdo the protein. Right now I get mine from the foods I take in. Its a rareity I do a protein drink anymore. This was on the advice of my surgeon.

[DocSanae]

Gout, in German is gicht-- and means "the blow from a witch's cane."
I believe it describes exactly the the kind of pain you have to endure.

When calculating your protein needs, you have to take into account your kidney function, actually (not to confuse you more, or rather, to confuse you more, I guess ) and if your kidney function is not up to speed, then you have to watch your total intake so it doesn't stress your kidneys.
As I said, you need to keep in mind that too much protein can do as much harm as too little protein. If you can, it would be best to have either your dr or your nutritionist calculate and give you the exact number for you. Also remember, too much protein can hinder your weight loss, this has happened in the past to some of our members.

Another fact about protein and food. Keep in mind that protein food basically are about 20% protein at most--so if you eat a 7oz meat--that would be about 198g-- the protein included in the meat will be around 40g, and fat, depending on which cut of meat, will be from 10-70g--the rest is water.

[DocSanae]

Okay, so....
Maybe this will add to the confusion?
I have managed to get my hands on a medical book published this year--Manual of Nutritional Therapeutics 5thEd. David H. Alpers et al.
p.586-Estimation of Recommended Daily Protein Intake.

Normal: g/kg IBW/day--0.75g protein (IBW=ideal body weight.)

Estimation of IBW for adults:
Woman with medium frame: 120lb for 5ft of height + 3lbs/in.
Man with medium frame:130lb for first 5ft of height + 3lbs/in.
Small frame: subtract 10lb from above.
Large frame: Add 10lb to above.

Even if you are 100kg now, if your ideal body weight is 70kg, then the calculation is 70x0.75, not 100x0.75.
FYI 1kg=2.2lb

I have listed only normal, because though the list has requirements for various medical conditions, there's none that weight loss surgery fits into.